Problems about devas
[580]
P.: “O Excellent One, the Blessed One has spoken the states that are causes and has spoken the states that are results together with their causes. O Excellent One, then, do devas exist or not, Lord?”
B.: “See, Great Sir, for what reason do you ask thus, ‘O Excellent One, do devas exist or not?’”
P.: “O Excellent One, if devas exist, do those devas come to this world or do they not come to this world, Lord?”
B.: “See, Great Sir, devas that are afflicted come to this world; devas that are not afflicted do not come to this world. May it be heard.”
Vidhūṭapha asks
[581]
When the Blessed One said this, Vidhūṭapha the minister addressed the Blessed One, saying: “O Excellent One, devas that are afflicted come to this world — will those devas then cause death for the devas that are not afflicted and do not come to this world, or will they drive them away from that place?”
At that time the Venerable Ānanda had the thought: “Vidhūṭapha the minister is a son of King Pasenadi Kosala; I am the son of the Blessed One. Now is an appropriate time for sons to converse.” Accordingly the Venerable Ānanda said to Vidhūṭapha the minister: “See, O minister, if that is so, on this point I will first put a counter-question to you. Whatever question pleases you, you should answer that question accordingly. See, O minister, how large is the realm of King Pasenadi Kosala, and within which realm does King Pasenadi Kosala rule as monarch? In that realm your Lord would be able to move or drive away which of the following? — consider it thus:”
(vertical list — one per line)
(samaṇa — ascetic / monk)
(brāhmaṇa — brahmin)
(one who is meritorious — punya-puggala?)
(one who is not meritorious — apunya-puggala?)
(one who has brahmacariya — has moral purity / brahmacharya)
(one who has not brahmacariya — lacks moral purity / brahmacharya)
Vidhūṭapha the minister answered: “O Excellent One, however large is the realm of King Pasenadi Kosala, and within whichever realm King Pasenadi Kosala rules as monarch, in that realm your Lord would be able to move or drive away ascetics or brahmins, those who are meritorious or not meritorious, those who have brahmacariya or do not have brahmacariya.”
Ān. “See, O minister, how will you regard the matter: in those places that are not the realm of King Pasenadi Kosala, of what extent are they, and in those places where King Pasenadi Kosala does not rule as monarch, in those places would your Lord be able to move or drive away ascetics or brahmins, those meritorious or not meritorious, those with brahmacariya or without brahmacariya?”
Vidhūṭa. “O Excellent One, in places that are not the realm of King Pasenadi Kosala, of whatever extent they are, and in those places where King Pasenadi Kosala does not rule as monarch, there your Lord would not be able to move or drive away ascetics or brahmins, those meritorious or not meritorious, those with brahmacariya or without brahmacariya.”
Ān. “See, O minister, how will you regard the matter: have you heard of the devas of the Tāvatiṃsa heaven?”
Vidhūṭa. “Yes, O Excellent One, I have heard of the devas of the Tāvatiṃsa heaven. Even now I have heard that the devas of Tāvatiṃsa, King Pasenadi Kosala has heard of them as well.”
Ān. “See, O minister, how will you regard the matter: could King Pasenadi Kosala cause the devas of Tāvatiṃsa to be moved or driven away from there?”
Vidhūṭa. “O Excellent One, even to behold the devas of Tāvatiṃsa King Pasenadi Kosala is not able; how much less could he cause the devas of Tāvatiṃsa to be moved or drive them away from there.”
Ān. “See, O minister, similarly: devas that are afflicted and come to this world — those devas would not even be able to see devas that are not afflicted and do not come to this world. How much less could they give them death or drive them away from there.”
Thereupon King Pasenadi Kosala asked the Blessed One: “O Excellent One, what is the name of this monk?” The Blessed One answered: “This monk is named Ānanda. May it be heard.”
[582]
P.: “His name is pleasing indeed; his state is pleasing indeed. O Excellent One, Venerable Ānanda has spoken the states that are causes and spoken the states that are results together with their causes. O Excellent One, do brahmas (Brahmā) exist or not?”
B.: “See, Great Sir, why do you ask thus, ‘O Excellent One, do brahmas exist or not?’”
P.: “O Excellent One, if brahmas exist, do those brahmas come to this world or not come to this world, Lord?”
B.: “See, Great Sir, brahmas that are afflicted come to this world; brahmas that are not afflicted do not come to this world. May it be heard.”
Thereupon a man said to King Pasenadi Kosala: “O Great King, the brāhmaṇa Sāñchaya Ākāsa-kula has come, O King.” Then King Pasenadi Kosala asked the brāhmaṇa Sāñchaya Ākāsa-kula: “See, O brāhmaṇa, who has been speaking this within the capital?” The brāhmaṇa Sāñchaya Ākāsa-kula replied, “O Great King, Vidhūṭapha the minister, the Buddha.” Thereupon a man said to King Pasenadi Kosala: “O Great King, now the conveyances are prepared, O Lord.”
He rejoiced in the Blessed One’s sayings
[583]
Then King Pasenadi Kosala said to the Blessed One: “O Excellent One, I asked the Blessed One about omniscience sappaññū ( all-knowing); the Blessed One prophesied omniscience, and what the Blessed One prophesied pleased and was fitting for me, and I rejoiced in what was prophesied. O Excellent One, I asked the Blessed One about the four pure castes cātur-varṇa ( four varnas/classes); the Blessed One prophesied those four pure castes, and what was prophesied pleased and was fitting for me, and I rejoiced. O Excellent One, I asked the Blessed One about the superior devas; the Blessed One prophesied the superior devas, and what was prophesied pleased and was fitting for me, and I rejoiced. O Excellent One, I asked the Blessed One about superior brahmas; the Blessed One prophesied the superior brahmas, and what was prophesied pleased and was fitting for me, and I rejoiced. O Excellent One, furthermore, whatever I asked the Blessed One about, the Blessed One prophesied that matter, and what was prophesied pleased and was fitting for me, and I rejoiced. O Excellent One, I now take leave, for I have many affairs and many duties.”
The Blessed One replied: “Great Sir, know the appropriate season now. May it be heard.”
Then King Pasenadi Kosala rejoiced and approved the Blessed One’s sayings, rose from his seat, made reverence to the Blessed One, performed circumambulation, and returned, thus.
Short Pāli Glossary (Pāli italicized, gloss normal)
deva — deva; celestial being / deity
Tāvatiṃsa — the Tāvatiṃsa heaven (a deva realm)
samaṇa — ascetic / monk
brāhmaṇa — brahmin
brahmacariya — brahmacharya; moral purity / celibate conduct
sappaññū — all-knowing / omniscient (term in context)
*varṇa (cātur-varṇa)* — caste / class (four classes)
Brahmā — brahma; a high celestial / brahma being
*anumodana / anumodana (approval)* — rejoicing / approval / assent